Avatars of War - Warthrone

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Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Carson on Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:42 pm

Here is the new version of warhammer by the ETC community.............interesting!

Rules are done and 1 army book, the rest have balancing rules until their eventual release.

http://www.the-ninth-age.com/news/

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  squalie on Sat Aug 22, 2015 9:04 pm

This may be something to consider as we already know the 8th edition rules and this just cleans those up. I like what I've read so far.

It would be nice if everyone in the community reads this and then AT LEAST posts to voice your opinion.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  The Apothecary on Sat Aug 22, 2015 11:37 pm

They still have not fixed Tzeentch so screw em

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  squalie on Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:40 pm

The Apothecary wrote:They still have not fixed Tzeentch so screw em

What do you mean specifically?

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  nathanr on Sun Aug 23, 2015 7:03 pm

On the whole I like it. The biggest problem that I see is that it is still an unofficial, unsupported game. We won't attract new players with a rule book that is out of print which needs an unofficial book of updates that they need to print out. Then they'll need to buy models that are becoming phased out and put them on square bases that they aren't packaged with. Then there's still the high GW pricing and the overly-strict ETC composition rules.

I don't want to be a negative nelly about this but that's a pretty steep hill to climb for a new player. Without new players we're going to stagnate as a group.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Carson on Mon Aug 24, 2015 8:49 pm

Has anyone cared to read through this? It is VERY well done and addresses the nagging problems from the 8th edition rulebook. I'd like to see what they do with the rest of the armybooks but the beastmen book looks cool. Warhammer based on these 9th age rules would be awesome.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  The Apothecary on Mon Aug 24, 2015 9:14 pm

squalie wrote:
The Apothecary wrote:They still have not fixed Tzeentch so screw em

 What do you mean specifically?

Well unless I am blind which may very well be, warpflame is still a thing and has not changed nor has their far to random magic lore, not to mention they even punched them in the balls a bit by making it so pink horrors don't even have a chance to get Infernal Gateway or Firestorm. So if anything they made them worse >Sad. Don't even have my ridiculous chart to maybe score an extra sucker punch with lol.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  squalie on Mon Aug 24, 2015 9:36 pm

nathanr wrote:On the whole I like it.  The biggest problem that I see is that it is still an unofficial, unsupported game.  We won't attract new players with a rule book that is out of print which needs an unofficial book of updates that they need to print out.  Then they'll need to buy models that are becoming phased out and put them on square bases that they aren't packaged with.  Then there's still the high GW pricing and the overly-strict ETC composition rules.

I don't want to be a negative nelly about this but that's a pretty steep hill to climb for a new player.  Without new players we're going to stagnate as a group.

Hell, it's about as official as Kings of War. Also, I got to thinking; the square base thing is going to be an issue regardless of the game we play. If anyone wants to start Kings of War and use GW figs (as I assume they'll do) they'll need to find square bases to play that game if they don't already have.

If that's too steep a hill to climb for a new player - I won't miss that kind of player.

And to Frank; you have Dark Elves, Orcs &Goblins and Ogres, but because they didn't fix a warpflame rule you're saying screw 'em?

Holy Jeebus, you guys are tough to please.

Pick a side of the fence to sit on - I don't care which, and let's make a decision on a game to play. Whether it's AoS, 8th, 9th (which is as official as playing 8th) or Kings of War, we need to figure out how to save this community.

- I actually enjoy AoS, with a point system I'd be just fine.
- I looked at the "Frost" thingee....it's not for me. C'mon Dean, you have a bunch of models, come back to the fold. I don't want to reinvent the wheel, I just want to play another wheel with the guys that have wheels.
- I would still play 8th.
- I like the ideas (most of them) for the changes to 9th, which could be (IS ?) a worldwide community - that's something? And it's kinda 8th.
- I will play 10 Kings of War games to get a feel for it and make a decision.
- I should play a few 40k games and see what I think. Dang, at least you know you could find a game (and community) anywhere for years to come. Plus, even if it's a mediocre game, it'd be awesome if it was our group playing.

Please don't sign in, read the posts and then leave as a lot do. We have about 5-6 voices on this forum and that's embarrassing. We need to hear from anyone with a passing interest in the game, ANY game.

I enjoy the company of a great many fellows in Saskatoon and I think my bi-monthly trips over the last few YEARS prove that. Find your voice, even if it's to say "I quit - I discovered boobies and I think I really like them".

Next.


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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  The Apothecary on Mon Aug 24, 2015 10:01 pm

Lol true enough Don, perhaps when they get to the Demons book this issue shall be resolved. Until then Ogres and Boobies (DE's) it shall be for this.... 9th edition  :>. I am more than happy to give it a try.

I really enjoyed what I played of Age, however if this group does not accept it then I am more than happy to move on to the next idea, however 40k is not something I am prepared to do. I am watching my funds like a hawk and buying in to a whole new game could pose as a difficulty. And before you say something silly like " Oh armies are cheap on Bartertown" or " Why not trade some of your WHF for 40K", #1 yes the initial purchase may not be OVERLY expensive, but I think we all know this game is a downward spiral of cash, and as Don enjoys saying " If you cant afford the lamborghini then you dont get to drive the lamborghini". And #2 I don't like getting rid of stuff, I still regret letting my Tomb Kings go. Ive just got hoarder blood in me or something. Also, I have never heard anything good about it from anyone I know that plays/played it. Maybe just all the years of hearing about how badly balanced and how easy it is to power game in it (not that I think anyone of OUR community would do that) has just left me with no desire to try it. Necrons do look amusing tho.

This Kings of War game seems neat and I am on board to give it a go. I have downloaded the free rule book and have glossed it over once or twice, but this weekend perhaps I shall give it a good read through. And hey if they want to support my WH armies so I don't have to spend money then that is just Icing on the cake.

There are my 2 cents be what they are

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  squalie on Mon Aug 24, 2015 10:20 pm

Perfect! Answers...I like answers. Very Happy

I'm certainly not trying to talk someone into - or out of - a specific game. I'm just trying to get a dialog going and free flow this to get some opinions and ideas out of the fellows I like to game with.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  blizzard435 on Mon Aug 24, 2015 11:25 pm

I've read through the 9th age and the kings of war rules. I do like the rules for 9th age but want to wait until it gets a bit more fleshed out. I want to play some more AoS personally to get a better feel for the game. 9th Age is pretty much a Beta so lets see where it goes; especially once they take a look at more of the army books! Kings of War is a different system. I gave it a look but I'm not sure on it. I'll have another look at it again if others want to play it more.

I'm also considering 40k if more people are interested in going that way. Seems to be very active, lots of players and still getting GW love.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  nathanr on Mon Aug 24, 2015 11:52 pm

I won't be making the switch to 40k.  As for kings of war/9th age/age of sigmar, I'm open to any and all.  I don't like the composition rules of 9th age but everything else seems great.  Age of Sigmar needs a point system (I like the one we've been using) but I think I'll get sick of it if we play it exclusively.  Kings of war seems like the best choice for me because it is an actual game that you can buy from a company that is supporting it and has models which have been created for it meaning new players don't need to figure out the secret handshake required to get into 9th age.  I'd like to try games of both 9th age and kings of war and see which I prefer before making a decision though.

I agree that this thread should be the hottest topic that this forum has ever seen. The fact that only 5 people have weighed in on a topic that deals with the very future of our hobby is a bit disconcerting. The "future of our hobby" thread has a few more posters and maybe those people that posted there have said all that they need to say but others are still strangely absent from the conversation.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Ironwoulf on Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:41 pm

Going to give Avatars of war a read.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  ScottRadom on Tue Aug 25, 2015 7:43 pm

Allright, 'cause you're pooling opinions...

8th still blows, not interested even a little in being a part of this system.

9th may be great but I just don't do unofficial rules sets. When I come across a rule I dislike in a game I just shake my head and figure "Oh well, that's the way the game designers did it" and move on. When it was designed by some dude I have issues. Every little problem drives me up the wall. Just a thing I have. Doesn't necessarily make sense.

Kings of war I might give a shot and play around with you guys a little. I still have a large Orc army I can field for any square based system. I don't think I'd really get behind it though. Just knowing it's not Warhammer makes me feel a little like I'm drinking Non Alcoholic beer.

Age of Sigmar is a soul crushing failure. There's just too many things I HATE about it. Basing not mattering, measuring from the mini etc... just a shit storm. F it in it's A.

40K, I'm slowly painting up some stuff for a nurgle themed force. I'll have some 32mm round based plaguebearers in case AoS gets playable somehow so there's always that.

Ordered the frost grave book on Mr. Dodge's say so.

Also ordered the Kings of War book.

And a note on community...

Well, I've turned into a complete Scrooge. I've met a lot of great people over the years and consider many of you reading this my good friends. I like the road trips, the good times, and I've found the games we play are mostly an excuse to get together and hang out and share. That'll never change for me. Now here's the semi-shitty part. I personally am not that concerned with pushing any particular system or growing the community as a whole. There I said it. If I've got 4-6 good friends that I've known for over a decade (and closer to 20yrs for some of you) that want to get together every once in a while THAT is reason enough for me to paint and build a project that provides a center piece for when we get together.

There was a time when I was really concerned about promoting the Warhammer game and drawing and retaining new blood. It was rewarding, frustrating, thrilling and exhausting. I'll never put myself in that position again. I even forgot how ridiculous it is trying to get people to commit to paintball. I used to organize pretty regular games and I remember the good times. What I totally forgot was the absolutely shitty amount of time and effort it took getting people to commit then herding them out to the site. I had 16 people say for sure they were going to play this last Sunday. Some bailed for legit reasons but most just didn't bother answering their phones. I had to cancel, boom there goes $200 dollars deposit. This in a nutshell is how I feel about developing a community.

I think everybody who gets into this hobby should feel that if they buy army books, a slew of metal and plastic, and spend the time and effort putting them together that they should make sure they won't feel ripped off if they never get to play even a single game. Of whatever system they choose. I've always tried to emphasize the collecting and painting portion of the hobby as that is easily where the most time on the hobby will be spent.

That's my two cents.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Carson on Tue Aug 25, 2015 10:14 pm

I agree with everything you just said other than the unofficial rules bit. I'm really easy.

Also, Avatars has also rolled out a mass battles system and have released army cross overs for all the disgruntled warhammer players. Good on you Bob for checking that out. I havn't read it yet but plan too soon.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Deadlytoaster on Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:04 pm

I like Don's post it brings up some great points.

I think AoS will always be a "sometimes" not the "always" game. (at very least until we see where it is headed in a year from now and whether is changes its tune or continues to chug along as it currently is, with alot of ok releases but nothing that gets me too excited)

KoW is really seeming like the best option to me. It's official rules, made by a company with good repute for writing rules and it feels like a modified warhammer (i like some was never crazy about 8th, it was ok)

I dont know about the frostgrave thing but i think i will leave that alone.

Avatars is worth a look i think atleast before passing it off, we ought to give it a peek.

As per the other thread i think we need to have a meeting over some drinks and have a good discussion about it in person (or maybe i am just an alcoholic and like beer)

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  squalie on Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:48 am

Getting together is a stellar idea. That's where you'll get real dialog and passionate opinions.

I didn't even know Avatars HAD rules?! They have some pretty cool models, I'm going to give their system a good read this evening. They don't have Beastmen, and I'm looking for an excuse to start Beastmen - for the 6th time. Very Happy

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Mhael on Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:55 am

I am down to roll dice over a table for any game EXCEPT 40k. Orcs in space bahhh. I am fantasy all the way. I havent found time to read over 9th age or kings yet so i will reserve judgement. In the spirit of community i think i should still open up my garage for whatever gaming (even flames for those who play) sometime in september.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  nathanr on Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:55 am

I gave the Avatars rules a quick skim, they look legit! Different formations giving your units different abilities in movement, combat and shooting is an interesting concept. They also have rules for some of the Warhammer armies and everything is free! Probably not quite as polished as the Kings of War game but definitely worth a look. I like Avatars of war minis better than the Mantic ones but I haven't been huge fan of Avatars' customer service in the past. Maybe they've upped their game in recent years but in the past it's been a lot of big promises without delivery.


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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  nathanr on Wed Aug 26, 2015 5:48 pm

I also found this on the Avatars of War forum:

http://www.avatars-of-war.com/eng/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1150

It is a progress report on the WFB army books being converted to Warthrone.  Looks like Beastmen is currently under review Don.

Here is a random review from Warseer (so pretty much meaningless):

"i want detailed, rich army lists with options for personalization and model not unit based, so kings of war not for me. in my case warthrone has all that i liked of warhammer in with more streamlined mechanics (easier movement, no crossing of tables, very simple and effective solution to resolve charges flankings and that), plus some extra wonderful additions (orders, formations, battle morale, scouting) that are superb for tactical enthusiasts like me, so i chose warthrone. "

Sounds good to me, I'm going to read the rules a little more in-depth later but I'm starting to think we could have a winner. Plus there are Bear Cavalry for dwarfs!

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  ScottRadom on Wed Aug 26, 2015 6:12 pm

nathanr wrote:I also found this on the Avatars of War forum:

http://www.avatars-of-war.com/eng/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1150

It is a progress report on the WFB army books being converted to Warthrone.  Looks like Beastmen is currently under review Don.

Here is a random review from Warseer (so pretty much meaningless):

"i want detailed, rich army lists with options for personalization and model not unit based, so kings of war not for me. in my case warthrone has all that i liked of warhammer in with more streamlined mechanics (easier movement, no crossing of tables, very simple and effective solution to resolve charges flankings and that), plus some extra wonderful additions (orders, formations, battle morale, scouting) that are superb for tactical enthusiasts like me, so i chose warthrone. "

Sounds good to me, I'm going to read the rules a little more in-depth later but I'm starting to think we could have a winner.  Plus there are Bear Cavalry for dwarfs!

This has me interested! I love AoW mini's and paint them on a regular basis. My only gripe with them is some of the older mini's have some poor mold damage they haven't fixed. Some of their multi part metal mini's have massive gaps in them to prep and fill. I still order and paint them up though.

I'll follow this and see what shakes out. From that review though I actually did like the KoW gripes the dude had. I've grown less fond of the massive customization of individual models. That little thing makes it way, way more necessary to be up to spped on each and every army list for warhammer. Needing to know that Chaos Lord "x" likely has the killer combo of this and that gets old quick when you're away from the game for a while.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  squalie on Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:44 pm

Scott, it's been no secret that your interest has been thin the last long while. Good to see you talking about it though - just like therapy! Very Happy

Skimming through the Avatars or War rules, and the Warriors and Tomb Kings "books" pretty much tells me if I switch to anything non-GW, it'll be this. It just feels a LOT like Warhammer with a twist - pretty much instantly recognizable and way more strategy than Kings of War. And MUCH better models if you want to use theirs. Some of their Chaos stuff is amazing.

I don't want to knee jerk this, but this has given me the best feeling so far as a replacement. It actually feels like reading a D&D book when you're reading through the army books and I love that! Movement is same, but more. Magic is same, but more and the phases are the same so we don't have to rewire 20 years of turn muscle memory.

I'm going to read the rulebook cover to cover and cruise their site for the next few days. When I rise to the surface I'll post some more thoughts.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Carson on Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:51 pm

Excellent, Good to hear some enthusiasm for a system. I'm a big fan of Avatars of war and will jump on board with this.

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Deadlytoaster on Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:53 pm

Does anyone have a link to the rules for avatars? I was a little confused where to look

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Re: Avatars of War - Warthrone

Post  Carson on Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:56 pm

google avatars of war, their site has a warthrone section that has free downloads of the rules and army pdf's. they read as if they are a warhammer book. Same unit names etc.

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